1. Interesting that there’s so much concern for Jada (and Will) but what about Chris? How will his future as a standup comic be impacted here? How comfortable will he be, getting up on stage, and worrying that he might offend someone.
  2. Originally posted by ap5:[..]
    Let’s go down the rabbit hole.

    Who defines “good taste” in a joke like Chris Rock told? Do I? Do you? Do we take a Twitter poll? Are we supposed to be completely well-versed in every single persons life story to know what might offend them?

    Guess what - people will say things to you and about you and your loved ones that offend you. Sometimes intentionally and sometimes inadvertently. It’s life. Unless you’re 5 years old, you don’t get to slap or hit the person based on what they said. Period.

    What Will Smith did was wrong and unacceptable. There is nothing to debate and there is no larger conversation to be had. He proved himself to be an immature and emotionally stunted person that likely has real mental health issues. He probably needs help. I hope he gets it.

    Sometimes wrong is just simply wrong. This is one of those cases.
    Why don’t you get to hit someone if they say something offensive to you? It isn’t really a fair balance is it. Someone with major mental health issues could be tipped over the edge by a comment but you can’t give the person making the comment a slap? Doesn’t seem fair. There are more people dying nowadays of suicide than there is of assault. Whilst we can’t link every suicide on people being verbally bullied or abused certainly a good chunk of it is down to that particularly amongst groups like teenagers. So an offensive remark can actually be more dangerous than hitting someone or slapping them, so why is it ok to say something offensive without expecting consequences? I’m going to give you an example I’ve been resisting making but like I said earlier if someone mocked me called me something I’d either laugh it off or if it was some random person I’d probably just tell them to piss off. I have a daughter though with autism and I can tell you now if someone mocked her I would do a lot worse than slap them. I know some people will disagree but the alternative is they just get away with it walking away laughing and I’m just not accepting that, I think there has to be consequences for what they say as it could hurt my daughter emotionally, it would probably hurt me tbh so they should feel pain too.
  3. The fact that you even ask the question of why we don’t get to hit people who say something you deem “offensive” shows there is no bridging our views on this topic.

    Whenever your child, co-worker, school-mate, partner or spouse ever says something that you find “offensive” by all means exercise your view that you should hit them.

    Good luck. And hire a lawyer. You’ll need it.
  4. Originally posted by RUMMY:Interesting that there’s so much concern for Jada (and Will) but what about Chris? How will his future as a standup comic be impacted here? How comfortable will he be, getting up on stage, and worrying that he might offend someone.
    If only humour he could do is mocking someone's illness, then yes, he might have problem. But then he is not comedian but just pathetic.
    But same goes for Will... he was laughing at first and after that probably someone told him something and just then he stood up for his wife.. and violence is never rhe way (even though it was deserved and not a big hit)
  5. Originally posted by ap5:The fact that you even ask the question of why we don’t get to hit people who say something you deem “offensive” shows there is no bridging our views on this topic.

    Whenever your child, co-worker, school-mate, partner or spouse ever says something that you find “offensive” by all means exercise your view that you should hit them.

    Good luck. And hire a lawyer. You’ll need it.
    There probably is no bridging our views but you have conveniently left out any mention of what I said about people committing suicide due to bullying and verbal abuse. If we know words can be as dangerous if not more dangerous than physical violence why are we to tolerate these abusive words in a society where they largely go unpunished? You would need to catch someone on film being racist or homophobic before you could get them done for hate speech probably, I don’t know if someone would even get into trouble for making a horrible remark about disability or special needs even if it was recorded, so why are these people allowed to walk about and have the negative impact on peoples lives they are having without consequences?

    I have to say I’ve been on this earth 30 years and I’ve not been in a fight since I was 15 which was the one and only time so I don’t go looking for violence. Maybe I’m just lucky generally associating with people that have a level of decency that we should be able to expect of others not to mock certain things. I was born in Glasgow where you do need to have thick skin at times around jokes but there’s a line that pretty much everyone I’ve ever met knows you don’t cross, not just with me but with anyone. You don’t go up to someone with a disability and mock them, you don’t go up to someone and use homophobic and racist terms. It’s really not difficult to live life having these basic standards and values. Offensive and hateful/hurtful are different things as well. Offensive things can be fixed out, hurtful nasty stuff there is no reasoning around.
  6. Originally posted by deanallison:[..]
    Why don’t you get to hit someone if they say something offensive to you? It isn’t really a fair balance is it. Someone with major mental health issues could be tipped over the edge by a comment but you can’t give the person making the comment a slap? Doesn’t seem fair. There are more people dying nowadays of suicide than there is of assault. Whilst we can’t link every suicide on people being verbally bullied or abused certainly a good chunk of it is down to that particularly amongst groups like teenagers. So an offensive remark can actually be more dangerous than hitting someone or slapping them, so why is it ok to say something offensive without expecting consequences? I’m going to give you an example I’ve been resisting making but like I said earlier if someone mocked me called me something I’d either laugh it off or if it was some random person I’d probably just tell them to piss off. I have a daughter though with autism and I can tell you now if someone mocked her I would do a lot worse than slap them. I know some people will disagree but the alternative is they just get away with it walking away laughing and I’m just not accepting that, I think there has to be consequences for what they say as it could hurt my daughter emotionally, it would probably hurt me tbh so they should feel pain too.
    It's not really about a fair balance but you can't physically assault somebody because of verbal abuse. I agree that language and words are very important - I do enough work in my professional life around this to tell you that - and whether they're misconstrued or not it can have devastating impact. But you really can't justify physical assault in any form. What discipline/standard does that set? Physical assault sets out more a dangerous example than verbal abuse. I'm not condoning the latter at all, but with physical assault comes more dangerous territory - you're giving kids a visual demonstration of why it's acceptable to 'set an example' on somebody. There's the argument that people in school were given the belt and that disciplined them, or hitting your kids would teach them a lesson. Actions have consequences.

    I'm sorry to hear about your daughter and I've worked in the charity sector, specifically disability, with emphasis on the language of disability and terms you shouldn't say, accessibility, etc. A fifth of the country that is treated poorly by society and government where people think it's acceptable to offend based on a disability they were born with or acquired - it's abhorrent and I know it's very frustrating at times. But I would honestly hope that you didn't retailiate with physical assault. Campaigning is more effective and when you start introducing violence to make your point, it dilutes that. I'm not saying you should just accept what people are saying, but there is so much more you can than just hit somebody.

    I'm not being awkward, but you can't suggest many suicides are down to verbal bullying and abuse without offering any research. Otherwise you're really just bending that point to satisfy an argument. But you have to remember that physical assault can lead to suicides as well. You're sort of normalising and justifying it, not realising that people can get PTSD - from a range of instances - but from physical abuse. Including domestic abuse, bullying, etc. There's more of a fine line than you realise.
  7. Originally posted by KieranU2:[..]
    It's not really about a fair balance but you can't physically assault somebody because of verbal abuse. I agree that language and words are very important - I do enough work in my professional life around this to tell you that - and whether they're misconstrued or not it can have devastating impact. But you really can't justify physical assault in any form. What discipline/standard does that set? Physical assault sets out more a dangerous example than verbal abuse. I'm not condoning the latter at all, but with physical assault comes more dangerous territory - you're giving kids a visual demonstration of why it's acceptable to 'set an example' on somebody. There's the argument that people in school were given the belt and that disciplined them, or hitting your kids would teach them a lesson. Actions have consequences.

    I'm sorry to hear about your daughter and I've worked in the charity sector, specifically disability, with emphasis on the language of disability and terms you shouldn't say, accessibility, etc. A fifth of the country that is treated poorly by society and government where people think it's acceptable to offend based on a disability they were born with or acquired - it's abhorrent and I know it's very frustrating at times. But I would honestly hope that you didn't retailiate with physical assault. Campaigning is more effective and when you start introducing violence to make your point, it dilutes that. I'm not saying you should just accept what people are saying, but there is so much more you can than just hit somebody.

    I'm not being awkward, but you can't suggest many suicides are down to verbal bullying and abuse without offering any research. Otherwise you're really just bending that point to satisfy an argument. But you have to remember that physical assault can lead to suicides as well. You're sort of normalising and justifying it, not realising that people can get PTSD - from a range of instances - but from physical abuse. Including domestic abuse, bullying, etc. There's more of a fine line than you realise.
    That’s honestly a great post Kieran, I know we’ve had our disagreements in the past but I can’t argue with anything you’re saying here. Genuinely well put and reasoned points.
  8. Originally posted by deanallison:[..]
    That’s honestly a great post Kieran, I know we’ve had our disagreements in the past but I can’t argue with anything you’re saying here. Genuinely well put and reasoned points.
    Glad we can agree, Dean.
  9. Just for the record, there is a difference between wanton violence and a bitch slap. Practicising violent sports or martial arts will loosen the grip that 'Violence' has on some people's minds.
  10. One could talk about speech or violence or actions all day long however what we saw was Rock touched a nerve in Smith and it prompted him to act. Simple as that.

    It reminds me of the time Bono quoted Van Morrison's "Inarticulate Speech of the Heart" line. Does anyone remember that or want to provide some context?
  11. I agree Smith shouldn't have done it,he should've just angrily shouted his disapproval if anything.Theres a comic in England called Jimmy Carr and what Rock said goes nowhere near the kind of stuff he comes out with,he was in trouble recently for his netflix special.Ive been to3 or 4 of his live tours which are really good but the odd joke can make you uncomfortable.But people know what they're getting when they buy a ticket.
    Mistake Rock made was doing the joke in front of thousands.
  12. "There can be a hundred people in the room, and 99 won't slap you, but one Will"