TJT
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Joshua Tree Tour 2019
 Legs (1): New Zealand, Australia and Asia
Shows: 15
  1. Originally posted by LikeASong:[..]
    Auckland2 is a very clear example that they CAN adjust the # of tickets after the show(s) took place. They've just split the total attendance of 69800 people between both nights, assuming the same number of fans (34900) attended both nights - when that's obviously not true.

    A very easy method to check when they're faking/masking attendance figures is checking the GROSS per show. There's no way to fake that figure and it speaks louder than a thousand words:

    Auckland 1 + 2 (two shows) gross: US $7.3 million
    Melbourne (one show) gross: US $7 million

    Actually also gross can be missleading, especially since the new model of dynamic prices of tickets has been adopted by LN, where some shows will get price reductions if the top price seats won't initialy sale. But if they do sale later at reduced prices,than we are dealing with the real sellout regarding the attendance,although the gross is lower... Plus gross is sometimes determined also by the venue specifics (I remember my popmart concert at wiener neustadt airfield where practicaly 80 percent of the tickets sold were GA that generaly have lower prices, hence the attendance was bigger than for exaple if they would play the gig in Vienna's Happel stadium, but the gross was lower) and economic state of the country etc.

    If you know the venue's normal capacitiy for concerts, you can pretty quickly determine if the show was a succes, especially for stadiums in Europe. I remember Bon Jovi listed a lot of ridiculous sellouts in Europe in recent years, where the stadiums were almost half empty (brussels, Zagreb... to name a few)...
  2. I think on all 360 shows there were some big blocks of seats, mainly behind the stage that didn't go on sale because of the height of the stage.. and as said before, I'm sure they can (and do) manipulate capacity numbers (quite) a bit but not sure if they (can) do that with actual attendance numbers. I think these days, with some ridiculous pricing going on, it's maybe harder to get 100% sell outs..
  3. U2wanderer1 cleared all this up I think except the bit he asked himself about a limit on giveaways. I think the attendance given in true, I think they can’t change the capacity after the event has taken place but I think before it’s taken place they simply giveaway all tickets they believe would otherwise go unsold and convince venues that certain areas shouldn’t be up for sale because of sight line issues (even though these same tickets would no doubt become available if the venue was sold out to the max). The giveaway of tickets means the capacity can be whatever the artist wants it to be. Maybe other bands just don’t get the same last minute surge as u2 and keep too many back. For example Guns N Roses was mentioned a few times let’s just make up a venue that has a capacity of 50k and let’s say they initially make them all available but only sell 30k, so maybe they giveaway 15k and think we can shift the other 5k before the show but only end up shifting 2k so they can’t claim a sell out. Then let’s say u2 play the same venue do the same thing but do manage to actually sell the 5k they didn’t giveaway that could be a sell out. Or they could have gave away 18k and only left 2k sold they 2k, that would also be a sell out. The capacity would be listed as 35k in the first scenario or 32k in that last scenario I gave you even though the true capacity of the venue was 50k. It would be listed as 35k/35k or 32k/32k, no mention of the true 50k.
  4. Originally posted by Ricku2:I think on all 360 shows there were some big blocks of seats, mainly behind the stage that didn't go on sale because of the height of the stage.. and as said before, I'm sure they can (and do) manipulate capacity numbers (quite) a bit but not sure if they (can) do that with actual attendance numbers. I think these days, with some ridiculous pricing going on, it's maybe harder to get 100% sell outs..

    Who talks about actual attendance? Nobody. That is one figure that just CAN'T be manipulated or inflated in any way, first of all because it's provided to the local authorities for regulation & safety reasons (in other words: a city doesn't do the same police/firemen/ambulance deployment for a 32k people gathering than for a 56k people one).
  5. Originally posted by celtic:[..]
    Actually also gross can be missleading, especially since the new model of dynamic prices of tickets has been adopted by LN, where some shows will get price reductions if the top price seats won't initialy sale. But if they do sale later at reduced prices,than we are dealing with the real sellout regarding the attendance,although the gross is lower... Plus gross is sometimes determined also by the venue specifics (I remember my popmart concert at wiener neustadt airfield where practicaly 80 percent of the tickets sold were GA that generaly have lower prices, hence the attendance was bigger than for exaple if they would play the gig in Vienna's Happel stadium, but the gross was lower) and economic state of the country etc.

    If you know the venue's normal capacitiy for concerts, you can pretty quickly determine if the show was a succes, especially for stadiums in Europe. I remember Bon Jovi listed a lot of ridiculous sellouts in Europe in recent years, where the stadiums were almost half empty (brussels, Zagreb... to name a few)...
    Of course the gross figure can be misleading with this new "dynamic pricing" disgrace, definitely. But it's still a valid figure to compare shows that are labelled as sellouts in the same (or very similar) country.

    On the other hand, knowing the venue capacity for concerts can be misleading too since there are some configurations that allow for more or less max tickets to be sold than the average capacity. But yeah, you got good points there
  6. Originally posted by LikeASong:[..]

    Who talks about actual attendance? Nobody. That is one figure that just CAN'T be manipulated or inflated in any way, first of all because it's provided to the local authorities for regulation & safety reasons (in other words: a city doesn't do the same police/firemen/ambulance deployment for a 32k people gathering than for a 56k people one).
    I thought you made some suggestions with saying "attendance figures were real up til 1998" and by making a comparison to album certifications in which you suggest they manipulate the actual numbers.. and by talking about the gross revenues which have zero to do with capacity, only with real attendance numbers.
    anyway, I think in general the actual attendance numbers speak for themselves and the sell out label isn't that important.. of course it's nice to really sell out the venue, but the label itself shouldnt be something you would lie for..
  7. Originally posted by Jamie32nz:This is quite impressive - from the ARIA awards site...

    U2 By The Numbers
    11 x #1 albums – the most for any group in the history of ARIA
    Over 55 Billion Streams Worldwide
    Over 170 Million Albums Sold Worldwide
    23 x Top Ten singles
    An incredible 79 x Platinum and 14 x Gold ARIA Accreditations
    24 weeks at #1 on the Albums Chart over their entire career
    16 x Top Ten albums
    19 x Top 50 Albums
    5 x #1 singles
    12 x weeks at #1 on the Singles Chart
    39 x Top 50 Singles



  8. Yeah but these 2 shows in ADam sold out literally in minutes.. I know because I tried to get the tickets. In the end (1st show, my evening) they pulled a 63K crowd for a venue that was only used to manage 53K. And that was really noticable
  9. Was just thinking how good The Fly visuals would have been with that massive JT screen, damn that would have been a sight to see.
  10. Anyway, interesting debate! On my side I'm gonna keep looking for proof that capacity # can be set after the concert has ended..
  11. Originally posted by Andrew_C:Was just thinking how good The Fly visuals would have been with that massive JT screen, damn that would have been a sight to see.
    The Fly was one I was hoping would return this tour
  12. They are saving The Fly for AB/20/20